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Joe Sixpack: "Why's your life so bad?... Too many illegals" Email Print

Let's face the fact; Democrats seem to be all over the place on the issue of immigration reform. Even self-proclaimed progressives can't seem to reach any consensus on this issue. Without fail, every discussion about immigration will at some point degenerate into accusations of racism, naiveté, and ignorance. We need to get a handle on this issue soon because the Republicans are about to create a storm of anti-immigrant backlash in the upcoming elections and Joe Sixpack is ready to choke it all down willingly. If you thought the Right Wing "Blame it all on the gays" campaign was something, wait till "It's all the "illegals' fault" starts showing up in the daily talking points. What's the matter with Kansas?... Illegals of course.

This recent piece in Newsweek should serve as a warning.
To Strengthen His Base, Bush Beefs Up Borders

Newsweek

Nov. 14, 2005 issue - The White House has a new plan to revive its conservative base: a tough approach to the nation's borders. Karl Rove met with House Republicans last week on immigration, an issue that has prompted sharp criticism of the president's proposals for a guest-worker program for the past two years.

Now aides are planning to roll out new plans to beef up border security. "Expect us to talk about immigration pretty aggressively and publicly before the State of the Union," says one senior Bush aide, who requested anonymity because of the politics involved. Bush conceded to GOP leaders in June that his immigration policy had stalled. "They had to come a long way on this issue, but they're finally starting to get it," says Will Adams, spokesman for Rep. Tom Tancredo of Colorado. Anti-immigration groups believe the new approach to border security is the direct result of Bush's political problems. But that still leaves intense negotiations on how to draw up a guest-worker program that can satisfy the GOP in Congress.

--Richard Wolffe and Daren Briscoe © 2005 Newsweek, Inc.

Every domestic failure of this administration is about to be placed at the feet of the undocumented immigrants, from failures on jobs and healthcare to education.

Here's how it will work:

Q. Joe Sixpack, do you know why you can't find a decent job?
Is it because of globalization, outsourcing, and decline in the manufacturing sector, a faltering economy or corporate greed, all of which were aided and abetted by an administration that is not only inept but morally corrupt.?
A. No way...It's illegals who come here by the millions every year to steal American jobs from hardworking people like you.

Q. Joe Sixpack, do you know why you can't afford decent healthcare? Is it because the big pharmaceutical companies and the insurance industry spend millions of dollars every year to bribe politicians to rig the system so they can make billions of dollars of profit from average Americans?
A. No way...It's because illegals go to emergency rooms and never pay the bill and hardworking people like you must pay the tab.

Q. Joe Sixpack, do you know why your kid can't read? Is it because this administration places no real value on education and has cut funding for it. That it places a costly mandate on the local level to "leave no child behind," while forcing them to cut other needed programs to pay for it. That nothing would make this administration happier than the dismantling of the public education system to be replaced by a voucher system for Christian madrasahs?
A. No way...It's because illegals send their kids (of which they have too many) to our schools for free, where we spend all your money to teach them English.

You can see where this leads.

Security..."How can we keep you safe from terrorism when there are millions of illegals getting in the way at the border?" Huge federal deficit..."illegals don't pay taxes." Every issue, no matter how complex, will be reduced  to a simplistic "Blame the illegals" answer. Just as all social issues have been reduced down to a battle between: right-thinking patriotic Christians vs. Pagan, liberal gay-loving elites.

We all realize that immigration reform is a very complex issue, and unfortunately all good propaganda has a small seed of truth. The "Joe Sixpack" campaign is no different. The point is that the real heart of all these problems lies not with illegal immigration, but with the unbelievable failures of this administration and its policies.

Many might say that the big corporations would never allow this kind of campaign because they need illegal immigration and profit from it. Wrong. If illegal immigration were to stop today, big business would just do what they've always done ... adapt.

When the unions forced corporations to increase labor costs, at first they simply replaced workers with machines, later when the remaining workers became too expensive, they packed up their tents like carnival snake oil salesmen and took their show elsewhere to places like China. They don't give a damn as long as they're making a profit. "No illegal immigrants here to pay low wages to? No problem! We'll go somewhere else where the labor is already cheap".

Big business has always made far more money from Republican economic policies than it saves by hiring undocumented workers. Even in the worst scenario, those businesses that found they really needed illegal workers would likely qualify for some sort of modified "Guest Worker" program. Small businesses would suffer from a lack of immigrant workers, but since they don't hold much sway with the major political players they would have to just sit back and watch.

We, as progressives, have to be ready to counter this kind of attack. Its power and appeal are immense. Not only does it shield the Republicans from their failures, it plays into the fears and racism that have always been a calling card of right-wing politics. The progressive community must do two things to counter this kind of campaign: reach a consensus on a comprehensive, fair, and practical immigration policy, and work out a strategy to make sure that the blame for all the failures of this administration fall where they belong: on the doorstep of the administration and it's supporters.

In general I think immigration sentiment seems to break down into three general groups within the Democratic Party. Although I must add a caveat here that I am oversimplify and using very broad strokes, their basic philosophies can be summed up as:

Closed Border Advocates: Those that generally feel that illegal immigration represents a threat to America both economically and socially. They feel that undocumented immigrants not only depress wages and take jobs from American workers, but also put undo stresses on our social service and education systems. They believe that there are mechanisms in place already for those who want to enter this country legally and immigrants should go through these proper channels.
Generally prefer stricter enforcement of the current immigration laws if not the strengthening of them. They see employers who hire un-documented immigrants as equally culpable and prefer higher penalties for employing them.

Economic Development Advocates: Those that believe that illegal immigration is a direct result of failures in the economic development and political policies in foreign countries. They feel that the only way to prevent illegal immigration is to treat its root causes, such as poverty, lack of education, political unrest, governmental abuse and corruption.
Generally prefer an approach that includes changing American foreign policy to foster economic development, coupled with a free trade policy that includes human rights, environmental and worker protections. They believe that over time, improving the situation on the ground in foreign countries would eliminate the conditions that encourage illegal immigration.

Open Border Advocates: Those that believe that continuous immigration is a natural state that has been occurring in America since before colonial times. That immigration has always been one of the chief contributing factors to America's success, and is impossible to prevent. They believe that the American dream has an overpowering appeal that will always draw new immigrants to its shores. They feel that the problem of illegal immigration is a direct result of the relatively modern restrictions placed upon the free flow of immigration.
Generally prefer changes in immigration policy that would make it easier for immigrants to enter and work in the country legally, by eliminating most restrictions. They would couple this with a more efficient system for documentation and naturalization.

From a completely pragmatic point of view we need to start to find a way to meld all three of these seemingly contradictory views into one coherent policy. A policy that addresses the concerns of those who feel their livelihoods and lifestyles are threatened. A policy that takes into account that immigration has always played a vital part in the growth and prosperity of this nation. A plan that recognizes that America and its policies have immense effects throughout the world and can do great good or cause great evil. A policy that is fair, practical, compassionate and humane.

We in the Progressive internet community are in the unique position to be able to start the process of hammering out the details of what could become policy on this issue. Through debate and discussion, we could do the heavy lifting that it would take to reach consensus.

The next time you hear Lou Dobbs talk about "Broken Borders" or Buchanan "The Death of the West", or see Minutemen patrolling the desert, remember this is just the tip of a very large iceberg. When the Immigration Titanic hits that iceberg, it will be those immigrants down in steerage that will go down with the ship, not the fat-cats on the promenade deck or the captain at the helm. We need to start to address this issue before its too late









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As my Golden Bears are getting schooled by USC, writing about immigration strikes me as a better use of my time than watching further embarassment.

First, I appreciate the discussion that's going here, with intelligent people. As some of you may or may not know, I get extremely vehement on this issue, especially when confronted with the kossacks who have swallowed a Dobbsian anti-immigrant paranoia. Ever since my experience with Prop 187 in SoCal in 1994, I have become virulently pro-immigrant, and see a Dobbsian anti-immigrant sentiment as something to be resolutely opposed. With violence, if necessary, but that's almost certainly where you and I all part ways. "Illegal" immigrants are some of the best people I've known in my life and the hatred and scapegoating directed their way makes me shake with rage.

And I'm usually a pretty calm guy.

I think first a historical perspective is useful. Until 1882 there were no immigration restrictions of any kind in North America, whether it was British colonies or the US of A. Beginning in 1882, however, restrictions started to be put into place. From the beginning they were racist in origin.

The 1882 law was the Chinese Exclusion Act, the product of anti-immigrant sentiments in California - SF in particular. Working-class Irish folks suffering from the Depression of the 1870s believed that their problems would be solved if the racially inferior Chinese were banned from the US. They got their laws passed, but of course their economic lot was not improved.

Still, a precedent had been set. Later, in 1906, Japanese immigration was restricted. In the 1910s the situation worsened dramatically - in 1917 a blanket ban on immigration from Asia was enacted and immigration from undesirable parts of Europe - from the racially inferior east and south - was severely restricted. In 1921 and 1924 these restrictions were even further tightened and made permanent.

In 1965, as part of the Civil Rights Movement, the Hart-Cellar Immigration reform was passed, which liberalized the race-based immigration quotas. But it did not eliminate them entirely. Instead certain kinds of labor was preferenced - skilled and educated labor. Since racially undesirable peoples such as Latinos were often unskilled, restricting unskilled labor appeased those who still wished to maintain racial restrictions on the composition of immigration.

The question of race and immigration today is simple to me. But it is complex to most Americans, who falsely believe we solved all our racial problems in the 1960s. The notion that the Civil Rights Movement cured racism impacts this discussion because it makes people deny that race plays any role in demands for exclusion or restriction. I can personally attest that this is simply wrong - in Southern California in the early 1990s, the "illegal immigrant" issue was really about "Mexicans." Even today "illegal" and "Mexican" or "Latino" are virtually interchangable terms. Few Americans are concerned about illegal immigrants from Europe or Canada - it's instead about brown people.

And the rules make this clear - whereas the obvious solution to our problem is liberalization of immigration law, most resist this. I can only conclude this is because of racial anxieties.

So what should we as Dems do?

Any solution we propose must conform with our core principles. It must not be exclusionary - meaning that we're almost bound to support an amnesty proposal. This also conforms with our principle which is that you do NOT blame the victim. Immigrants have worked hard and deserve full benefits of American life, including naturalization or at the least legal residency.

Some whine that this may encourage more illegal immigration. I say "whine" because this reveals a fundamental misunderstanding of the issue. People do not immigrate here illegally because they want to come that way. Virtually every illegal immigrant wishes to come here legally. They come illegally because they have to, because they believe the economic rewards are worth the high risks. In short, an amnesty has little effect on rates of illegal immigration.

Instead we need to liberalize our immigration policies to better reflect economic realities. If American businesses are seeking unskilled labor, we need to then admit this and make it easier for people immigrate legally with that skill set.

Some call this "open borders" and as I note above, there's no shame in this. But it's also false. Liberalized immigration rules actually make the border MORE secure. This is because it encourages people to cross at US Customs-staffed Ports of Entry, where security concerns are best addressed. With fewer people crossing the undefended northern and southern borders, what little security risk exists is then eliminated in whole. Trust me - people would rather go through an air-conditioned office in Nogales or a warm, dry office in Blaine than the Sonora desert or the North Cascades.

"Illegal" immigrants - and other immigrants - have seen some success in labor organizing. This is an aspect of the issue that most so-called liberals neglect. If labor is organized, all the problems identified with illegal immigration go away. No more exploitation, no more undercutting of wages. We MUST, absolutely MUST, be encouraging of labor organizing in the fields and factories of America.

Obviously, if illegal labor is organized and unionized, then it competes on an even level with other sources labor. The incentive for employers to use illegal labor is gone. So unionization has got to be a centerpiece of our efforts.

Some folks argue, as Duke1676 calls it, from an "economic development" approach. I say we call their bluff. Repeal NAFTA. Replace it with trade agreements that insist on environmental and labor protections commensurate with those enjoyed by the US. End US governmental support of corrupt regimes - something that has historically happened in concert with US corporate exploitation. Support political forces in source countries that will provide true and widespread economic improvements. This means that the US must abandon its 100-year long fight against Latin American leftist movements.

Here again the Dems are best positioned to act. Our approach has historically been to regulate private enterprise for the public interest. We must do so again.

One might notice something in the above - what I'm calling for is nothing short of the implementation of the full social democratic agenda that liberals have been calling for since 1932. That's no coincidence. To assume immigration is a problem outside other political problems - a common assumption - is to misread the situation profoundly.

In the end, though, we must insist that any discussion if immigration - legal or illegal - proceeds from this all important point:

Immigration is NOT a major factor in or cause of US economic difficulty.

Thanks for reading.

I'm not a part of a redneck agenda - Green Day

by eugene on 11/12/2005 06:49:33 PM EST

your analysis is dead on.

I have two points that I need clarification on.

1.) unionization: Although it would be ideal if we could revitalize the union movement in American, given the current climate I fear this would be a tough nut to crack. We can't get Americas largest employer to even discuss the idea of unionization. For sake of the immigration argument would we not be better served to demand that the federal government institute the policies and protections that we would traditionally expect from unions. A true living wage, demand that employers provide health benefits and aid them in providing them, retirement plans, family leave, safe workplace restrictions etc. Not in the sense of the pro-business, watered-down stuff we have now, but real programs that work. If the government would codify such things perhaps the idea of unionization might be more appealing to the Walmarts of the world.

2.) The sale: how do we sell such a plan to the American people? It would have to be presented in a manner that was simple, and stressed the benefits that would be experienced by all.

by Duke1676 on 11/12/2005 07:36:16 PM EST

[ Parent ]
As you define them, I am a meld of all three stances you're laying out.

As a Closed Border Advocate, I do indeed think the use of illegal labor depresses wages. And I think they take a toll on our country economically and socially -- not the way the hard right means it, but as existing as a fearful and exploitable underclass. They're used by MegaAgriculture to depress wages, to stymie technological innovation and to get around such stalwart progressive labor issues as overtime, benefits and other labor standards.

As an Economic Development Advocate, I do believe the if the U.S. aided other countries in stabilizing their own economic system, the pull of working for shit on our side of the border -- which is much higher than they get on theirs -- would lessen.

As an Open Border Advocate, I DO believe immigration is a natural part of the economic process, and certainly of our own American history.

That said, I think we need to get a realistic grip on how much immigrant labor this country needs -- a real, honest look at it -- and then begin to set  and stick with those annual numbers. What should go into that equation, beyond the immediate labor demand, is the realization that as our population ages, we  need to have more workers. With an aging work force ourselves, and another one clamoring to be put to work, it just makes sense to let them come in.

BUT -- and this is a big BUT -- they need to be documented. We need to know who's here. Not just for national security reasons, but to enable them to NOT be exploited, to feel no fear at reporting abuses. And they need to be paid minimum wage and be offered the protection of all our labor laws.

As to undocumented workers being a strain on the social system and infrastructure ... BAH. I don't buy it. I think they bring much more to this country -- a work ethic, ambition, sales tax revenues -- than they take from it. Certain specific school districts or hospitals may need some federal help (and I think it's unfair that the state governments are having to bear the fiscal cost of a national problem), and I think that needs to be addressed.

As you can see, I don't have the traditional progressive take on this (which in my understanding is a little weak on the documentation/possible number limit issue). I don't want people here without documentation. But whether it's as a guest worker or permament resident, they need to be on record so they can't be exploited.

by SusanG on 11/11/2005 11:09:01 PM EST

Having both worked in, and owned restaruants for almost thirty years in both Miami and New York, I've seen the lunacy of the immigration system first hand. These experiences have no doubt influenced many of my veiws on the subject. I have met hundreds of immigrants, legal and illegal, delt with green cards and temporary work permits. As an employer I've gone through the process of sponsoring workers as they've attempted to achieve legal status. After all of this I still to this day have no clear answer to the problem.

I think the documentation problem could be addressed by eliminating the arbitrary nature and sometimes political motivations of the current quota system. The government has, on occasion used immigration policy as an extension of foreign policy. One example was in the mid 80's when immigrants from "friendly" Central American nations seemed to get preferred treatment.

If in fact if a quota system is needed, (and I'm not as of yet convinced we need one) it somehow needs to be equitable and of course realistic. To set numbers that in no way reflect the current realities of what's going on merely set the system up to fail. You're right about taking a serious look at the actual numbers of immigrants that can be absorbed both economically and socially, but the current quota numbers are simply unrealistic.

Having never met an immigrant who wouldn't give his/her right arm to be legal, if we made the process easier we could easily have every immigrant that enters this country be fully documented. I strongly believe that the main problem with illegal immigration is the "illegal" part of the equation. If we could figure out a way to foster legal immigration (on a realistic level) there would be no problem.

If we could tackle the documentation problem, many of the other "problems" would be eliminated. Exploitive wages, an underground economy and a permanent under-class, living in the shadows of society would be eliminated.

But...we must deal with the elephant in the room. How are we to handle the possible 10-20 million undocumented workers that are already here? I would strongly support any method possible to make those that are already here, gainfully employed, and free from criminal activity, legal and documented as soon as possible. I also realize that this is one of the bones of contention for many.

 

by Duke1676 on 11/12/2005 12:46:24 AM EST

[ Parent ]
to getting the currently present but undocumented workers on record is to offer another amnesty.

But we did that in the 1980's, and without a concurrent crackdown on the flow, it's just going to be seen as another invite ... go ahead and come on over, wait a decade, you'll be made legal through amnesty. So it doesn't solve the problem. You need a final granted amnesty and an enormous crackdown on the flow.

What I think HAS to happen is that mega-fines are laid on the employers of illegals. Don't do a damn thing to the "caught" worker except deport -- after all, they're displaying belief in the American dream by taking risks and working hard to get here. But if you crackdown seriously on the employer (which we've NEVER done), and there is no place for illegal immigrants to be employed, the flow will stop (or at least drop to a trickle).

(Fences and such nonsense at the border are ridiculous, akin to Star Wars. You simply can't patrol or build a wall big enough to keep them out -- unless you use undocumented workers, of course.)

Here's what I'd propose if I were King of the World: Three strikes and you're out, Mr. Employer. First violation of employing an undocumented worker by a corporation or MegaFarm (I'm looking at you, WalMart), $100,000. Second violation, $1 million. Third violation, corporate charter revoked. Bam. You don't exist anymore as a functioning business entity.

You think the trade-off of cheap labor would still look so cheap? The risk ratio would be enormous. For smaller businesses (restaurants such as you worked in), adjust the fines but have them just as stringent, percentagewise: $10,000, $50,000, then the third strike, you're out of business.

That's my proposal.

by SusanG on 11/12/2005 01:16:25 AM EST

[ Parent ]
I agree that the Reagan amnesty was a joke, but that's because it wasn't followed by any reform in immigration policy. It was basicaly a gift to business to get them off the hook.

As to the large fines for employers...I believe it will create many more problems then it solves. What happens to the millions of workers already here. Many have families, children born in this country who are citizens, have been here ten or twenty years. They view this country as their home, they are just not legally allowed to be here. Employers, large and small would all react the same way when faced with the prospect of large fines ..."thanks Jose, I know you've been with us for ten years but..you gotta go." Now we're faced with millions of unemployed workers with no means of legal employment. But that doesn't mean they wouldn't find work and just go "home", for many this is home. They would just move further underground into the cash economy jobs in the smaller, less regulated business. They would be further exploited and eventually the situation would be worse than it is now. We would also have to find millions people to fill the newly vacated jobs that the immigrants have left behind,many of which are on the lower end of the economic scale. There aren't enough unemployed and under employed in this country to fill that many vacated jobs. We have no real solid numbers on the true number of undocumented workers but estimates run up to 20 million.

I think an amnesty followed by REAL immigration reform which allows larger numbers of immigrants to enter legally, and documents them, is a better way to go. We can make the requirements to get in as tough as we like, but we must face the fact that they will come. Until the situations that exist in their countries of origin change we cannot stem the flow.

One way to facilitate this kind of thing would be to work with the countries of origin to improve conditions. For example we could offer to raise the quota for immigration from Mexico if certian economic and human rights conditions are met. Those changes would eventually start to elieviate the very conditions the cause immigration. Foriegn aid would also be tied to the policy.

If we made it easier for those who want to come here to work and make a better life to join society legally, I feel the whole thing would be easier to regulate. Under the current system with no means for legal immigration for many, the only option is illeagal immigration.

In a way it's like Prohibition , or the drug laws...If you make something illegal that you can't stop people from doing, you make criminals out of everyone. Thats what we've done with immigration...made them ALL criminals.

by Duke1676 on 11/12/2005 02:12:34 AM EST

[ Parent ]
Was with the assumption that the workers already here would get amnesty and the businesses employing them currently would not be fined, but that stringent fines would be in place for those who employ newcoming undocumented workers after a cut-off date.

Let's say we declare an amnesty for January 1, 2007. That means every illegal worker here gets documented by then. After that date, any employer hiring an illegal immigrant would get hit with these fines -- and they'd know these fines were coming a year in advance.

There are other areas that need reform in the immigration policy as well, but to me, this is the heart of it. If there is NO opportunity for employment, they wouldn't come. And I think the employers should pay the brunt of the price for breaking the law and encouraging illegal immigration.

Sorry I didn't make the timetable clearer in my initial comment.

by SusanG on 11/12/2005 10:11:51 AM EST

[ Parent ]
If in fact a new more equitable system of immigration was implemented, accompanied with a foreign policy that helped alleviate the inequities and poverty that exists rather than perpetuating them, the situation would be totally different.
Under those circumstances there would be no real reason to employ undocumented workers except to exploit them to drive down labor costs. Given that scenario the most draconian penalties would be warranted for employers who hired illegally.
The same could be said for the immigrants. If ample opportunities exist for legal immigration yet one was to choose to circumvent the system by entering illegally, the penalty should be immediate deportation on the spot.
Once the system was reasonably equitable and reflected the realities of the need for controlled immigration, the penalties for those who broke the law should be stiff.

by Duke1676 on 11/12/2005 12:20:14 PM EST

[ Parent ]
Are the unscrupulous labor brokers who facilitate rounding up laborers for exploitation. One of the sadder stories I've heard is that of the laborers recruited from Texas and Mexico, sent to New Orleans, worked under extremely poor conditions and then sent home with Nothing.

I heartily agree that fining the corporations and their subcontractors who traffic in exploited workers is a good option.

Those stories of Chinese workers trapped in cargo containers for weeks are equally tragic.

I'd frankly like to see a crack down on the coyotes who leave people to die in the desert and in truck trailers, the brokers who live on the misery of others, and corporations who abuse these people.

That said, I do think there's a national security component to this issue. For all the talk about security we haven't yet made significant efforts to secure our ports and borders--north and south.

What I really find appalling is the Republican cycism implicit in their complaints about foreigners using hospitals and schools. God Forbid they'd fund any improvements in social programs!  Instead of appealing to the better angels of our nature, they've chosen to appeal yet again to some of our baser notions: racism, xenophobia, and the siren call of the KnowNothings.

by greatbasin2 on 11/19/2005 04:36:10 PM EST

[ Parent ]
and those that traffic in human misery. They are the lowest form of human life and should be treated as such. I view them no differently than Africans willing to sell their neighbors into slavery or the quislings who collaborated with Nazis. They seek profit or power through the suffering of their own people.

It must be remembered though, that they can only exist because of a failed US immigration policy. If we had a rational and somewhat equitable system there would be little need for people to pay these people for the privilege to of wondering through a hellish desert or being locked in the bowels of a cargo ship.

Once we reform our policies and practices, hopefully this human trade would cease to exist at the current levels.

But yeah . . . hang them from the highest tree. They are the lowest of the low.

by Duke1676 on 11/19/2005 09:14:48 PM EST

[ Parent ]
on what the Bush Administration is doing (or not doing?) to crack down on labor brokers/contractors and on the coyote operations?  For example, has the Administration launched any kind of major investigation of the creeps who hired all the young men from Texas and Mexico for the NOLA clean up and then sent them packing with no pay?

by greatbasin2 on 11/19/2005 09:38:11 PM EST

[ Parent ]
the creeps who hired all the young men from Texas and Mexico for the NOLA clean up and then sent them packing with no pay?

Halliburton

like that comes as any surprise.
I don't think there will be any investigation on that one any time soon.

by Duke1676 on 11/19/2005 11:45:21 PM EST

[ Parent ]
I keep getting op-ed submissions from someone who hates illegal immigration and seems to conflate it with a terror threat from those evil Muslims.  Her stuff reads like pure xenophobia and I keep rejecting it, not wanting to alienate potential Latino or Somali Muslim members (Our county has many from both groups living and working here).

"But everyone is talking about this problem," she keeps telling me.

I would have to say that, among my friends and party members, illegal immigration seems to be down the list a ways--somewhere between parking tickets and eczema.  Is there a yahoo brigade I'm not hearing from?

by rhubarb on 11/15/2005 02:13:02 PM EST

but they are. It's been creeping into the talking points little by little. Listen for the codeword: "securing the borders"

They couldn't care less about making our borders secure. If they did we would be checking container ships and airplane cargo. "Securing the borders" and "making or borders safe" really means keeping out the brown people that seem to make them so uncomfortable.

by Duke1676 on 11/19/2005 08:32:24 PM EST

[ Parent ]
would be the wealth of information gleaned from it. As of now, we have no real idea how many undocumented workers really are in the country. We don't know when they came, what they do etc.
If we were to figure out a way to run an amnesty program while simultaneously controlling the flow of new immigrants entering the country, it would give us great insights into the information needed to formulate a sustainable immigration policy.
The questions SusanG raised earlier such as how many new immigrants the nation can absorb both economically and socially to fill the need created by an aging population could be answered better once we have the historical data on what's happened so far.
Again though, we must figure out ways to put theory into practice.

by Duke1676 on 11/12/2005 03:36:26 PM EST

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